JB/137/012/001

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1819 July 1 +

To Erskine Der For Radicalism not &c ? Let. 7
§8. Ref 4

or 1
Under Self acting democracy
good order unexampled
for 5 years, why not
under representation
for ever unless imposed
by foreign tyranny?

Now when seeing that even a self acting democracy thus
reigned for five years in peace and happiness what was there to
hinder a representative that so prodigiously unproved a substitute
to a self acting a representative democracy from thus reigning
unless imposed by foreign external tyranny — to the end of time.

or 2
Object of Charlemont
fears was not the
seeing government
worse conducted but
better. Of During the self-acting
democracy he was at
the heart: so he would
probably have been
of the representatives:
but only during behaviour
(reputed) good: and
not without much trouble.
Under the corrupt mixt
Monarchy he was one
of a narrow aristocracy
the House of Lords, with
and nominated to sit
of another House of Lords
called a House of Commons
and without trouble

When therefore for the Earl of Charlemont betrayed this
new and uncorrupt government into the hands of the old corrupt
government of what was it that he was afraid? Of seeing the
business of government not so well conducted as before? as it might be under the old system no: but of seeing
it so continue to be much better conducted During the than it was, his interest
it should be. During the self-acting democracy, he was
indeed at the head of it: under the representative democracy
he wa might and probably would had it as pleased him been
have been at the head of it: but the his continuance in that
situation would have had to depend upon his good behaviour.
that is upon such behaviour as by in the eyes of his constituents should
have been deemed good and at no time without much trouble. But, under the corrupt mixt monarchy
he was one of a small narrow aristocratical body composing
the House of Lords; and had at the same time the nomination
of one or more two out of of the Members of another branch of that
same aristocracy, sitting in what was should have been called
another House of Lords, but was called a House of Commons.

or 3
It being then his interest
to concurr in dissolving
the only good government
Ireland ever saw, much
more was it that of all
the other Lords and Seatholders

But if even he who was who was the first man in the democracy saw
it, the most clearly he did see it, to be more for his interest
meaning always his private and personal interest — to concurr in dissolving the dissolution of
th it that only good government than to concurr in the support of it, much more clearly

or 4
Thus were all made
traitors who with more zeal
than prudence aimed at good
government instead of bad: and gave Lord Holland the praise of candour in landing the mercy shewn only the remission of vicarious punishment in one instance 1819 30 June

Most all the other elected chiefs perceive have perceived their respective interests
to be the same way: and thus it is clear the only good government
Ireland had ever seen was dissolved, all when two of their country
had more zeal in it than prudence in it were placed in the predicament
of traitors, and thus it is that the Whig Lord Holland has to compliment worship his old friend the Tory
Minister for the inconceivable grace of ceasing in the person of the FitzGerald to punish the unobnoxious
children for the law fallacious law styled treason and real patriotism. of that

Lords Debate 30 July 1819
Morn. Chron. 1 July 1819

Identifier: | JB/137/012/001"JB/" can not be assigned to a declared number type with value 137.
Date_1	1819-07-01	Marginal Summary Numbering	or 1 - or 4
Box	137	Main Headings	parliamentary reform
Folio number	012	Info in main headings field	to erskine for radicalism not &c?
Image	001	Titles
Category	text sheet	Number of Pages	1
Recto/Verso	recto	Page Numbering	c2
Penner	jeremy bentham	Watermarks
Marginals	jeremy bentham	Paper Producer
Corrections		Paper Produced in Year
Notes public		ID Number	46729
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